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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 09 Mar 2009 :  07:54:07 AM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Ros,

Yes, Nishtar is her dam but there are 3 Nishtar...Am presuming she is the Nishtar by Jubilee Star????
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mogwai
Platinum Member


England
2717 Posts

Posted - 09 Mar 2009 :  08:28:55 AM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add mogwai to your friends list Send mogwai a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sorry, yes she is Nishtar by Jubilee Star
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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 09 Mar 2009 :  12:12:09 PM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thank you Ros! A different dam line could potentially change the outcome but in your case, can only imagine something sensational. When you visit..see if you can bring back some pictures to share. He is definitely a favorite!
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kirst
Silver Member

Scotland
460 Posts

Posted - 09 Mar 2009 :  10:02:40 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add kirst to your friends list Send kirst a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks, Gari. I have only seen photographs and been told about her character but it seems you are just about spot on!

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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 10 Mar 2009 :  09:29:46 AM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Kirst,

It would be helpful to know her pedigree in full but two additional things: IF the Rissla is found on the dam's side of the pedigree, would expect her motion to be reasonably spectacular.

Secondly the double Hamdani Simri should confer a near magical quality on her...the "Je ne sais quois" quality that marked the Hamdani Simris for Lady Anne. Would love to see photos when it is convenient.
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Judith S
Platinum Member


Wales
15686 Posts

Posted - 21 Mar 2009 :  9:35:38 PM  Show Profile  Visit Judith S's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Judith S to your friends list Send Judith S a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Rameed is now 21 (looks 1/2 that age) & is with us for the rest of his life - his last babies Ruby & Charlie - well we are totally delighted with them - & they are for keeps!

We would like to put him to Manon bint Tarim for a foal to keep & wondered what you think of that mating? Hoping for a lovely, solid, riding horse!!!!

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/rameed

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/manon+bint+tarim

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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 21 Mar 2009 :  10:42:40 PM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hmmmm...Rameed is sire line Mesaoud and dam line Sobha, thus Hamdani Simri...so am not surprised he is a very youthful, good looking gent...His pedigree would suggest he is very sweet and slightly mischieveous...in a kindly way. Smoother bodied than the picture would suggest...with lovely motion as he is blessed with *Rissalix...

Crossed to Manon Bint Tarim, would expect you would have a lovely flaxen foal that will be a superb riding horse as her dam's sire line is to *Rissalix, a *Berk grandson, and *Rissalix is repeated three times through Oretta, thus matching up wonderfully with Rameed's pedigree.

Overall a very attractive youngster who will take his/her time maturing that will be very pleasing to the eye who will be a superb riding horse. Will look forward to seeing pictures!
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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 22 Mar 2009 :  10:59:32 AM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Kastell,

Here are your question from the Crabbet thread:

"A question re the strains, are there any pictures / drawings that anyone has done to show the attributes to the particular strains? I think that would be really helpful to us beginners, so that we can see the differences. Also with a description of their dispositions / characters that come out with the strain? Or could you Gari post some pics of good examples of certain strains? Also Gari you mentioned that Handani Simiri (sp!) would be good on Rodania mares, does this mix also work well the other way around? I know it sounds like a silly question but I was just wondering if this made any difference!!!??

Do you think that Lady Wentworth would have gone back to Egypt & acquire some Straight Egyption stock to put with her Crabbet Stock? Maybe to re-introduce some lines that had been lost at Crabbet? I don't know much about Straight Egyptions but am assuming that their pedigree's are fairly well documented. I remember seeing a picture of the beautiful mare Aliha who was by the straight crabbet stallion Indian Silver out of AK Atallah, who I think was Egyption with some Babson blood??"

In re strains:

You are touching on what my book is about but for now I'll point out two typical stallions of the Seglawi strain and of the Rodania strain...One Polish, the other predominately Crabbet with a bit of Davenport:

The stallion Ecaho,

http://www.wintersteenarabians.com/ecaho.htm

is very typical of the Seglawi strain of Woloszka. He is typical Seglawi in that his head is slightly longer than you would see on a Kuhailan, he is very upright and moves elegantly. The personality characteristics of the Seglawi: Extremely loyal often tending to be very attached to one human, is extremely courageous, very elegant. Some lines are exceptionally intelligent especially those coming via the Davenport import, *Wadduda.

US National Champion Raffon, http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/raffon

is a typical Kuhailan, substrain, Dajania...He is a bit rounder, shorter headed, a bit stockier....The Kuhailan Dajanias are kindly, athletic and are phenomenal stallion creators...They are not as demanding as the Seglawis nor Rodanias...

As a general rule - covers work well both ways...Hamdani on Rodania and vice versa. BUT the results tho' outstanding will be governed by the mare's line.

No, I don't think Lady W would have gone back to Egypt because, so many are well over 25% Crabbet blood of which she had a lot of. Instead she would keep her eye out for the stallion that most exemplified what she was trying to achieve! That is why many of us think her first choice would have been *El Shaklan, a Spanish/Egyptian cross, aka the Golden Cross who was an absolutely stunning individual.






Edited by - Egbert on 22 Mar 2009 11:09:05 AM
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rosie
Platinum Member


England
3662 Posts

Posted - 22 Mar 2009 :  8:21:42 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rosie to your friends list Send rosie a Private Message  Reply with Quote
ohhhh Egbert. Could I ask a question or 2 please?
I own Rose Alba (Tribune/Rose Ruby). Shes been with me now for over 18 years & is my horse of a lifetime.
what do you think of her pedigree?
After losing her yearling last year to a tragic accident I am slightly considering putting her in foal again. Who would you suggest? A stallion with a high % Crabbet maybe?
I'd like to breed another Arab who is as versatile as she is & possibly a little extra height, she is 14.3 h.h.
Theres some pics of her on 'Arabs performing - a pictorial evidence'.
Lisa




Last picture courtesy of Sweet Photography
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Judith S
Platinum Member


Wales
15686 Posts

Posted - 22 Mar 2009 :  8:57:27 PM  Show Profile  Visit Judith S's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Judith S to your friends list Send Judith S a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Egbert

Hmmmm...Rameed is sire line Mesaoud and dam line Sobha, thus Hamdani Simri...so am not surprised he is a very youthful, good looking gent...His pedigree would suggest he is very sweet and slightly mischieveous...in a kindly way. Smoother bodied than the picture would suggest...with lovely motion as he is blessed with *Rissalix...

Crossed to Manon Bint Tarim, would expect you would have a lovely flaxen foal that will be a superb riding horse as her dam's sire line is to *Rissalix, a *Berk grandson, and *Rissalix is repeated three times through Oretta, thus matching up wonderfully with Rameed's pedigree.

Overall a very attractive youngster who will take his/her time maturing that will be very pleasing to the eye who will be a superb riding horse. Will look forward to seeing pictures!


Ah thank you! you have Rameed off to a tee - he is the sweetest boy - but with a great sense of humour - who would be very naughty - if only he could bring himself to be He also has the most amazing slow motion off the floor trot


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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2009 :  08:54:05 AM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
[right]Originally posted by rosie

ohhhh Egbert. Could I ask a question or 2 please?
I own Rose Alba (Tribune/Rose Ruby). Shes been with me now for over 18 years & is my horse of a lifetime.
what do you think of her pedigree?
After losing her yearling last year to a tragic accident I am slightly considering putting her in foal again. Who would you suggest? A stallion with a high % Crabbet maybe?
I'd like to breed another Arab who is as versatile as she is & possibly a little extra height, she is 14.3 h.h.
Theres some pics of her on 'Arabs performing - a pictorial evidence'.
Lisa
[right]

Hi Lisa!

She has a lovely pedigree-another sire line to Mesaoud, terrific lines to Raktha/Naseem with her sire's dam line going to the wonderous *Ferda...which gives that extra super kindness factor plus she has Bright Shadow down on the dam line via the legendary Silver Sheen and loads of pretty and motion via Irex and Rose Diamond...Her strain is of course, Kuhailan Rodania....Hmmm Well this is a case I'd be pushing all the Carmargues as I think everyone breeding today would be brilliant for her...Camargue Too, WSA Charismma, Ali Khamsin...Can't remember is Ocean Eilat a stallion and breeding in the UK? Then for those farther afield....the colt in Scotland Monescosia by Ajaman Moniscione x Estoniah that is very very interesting and I think he has good size

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/index.php?query_type=horse&h=MONESCOSIA&g=5&cellpadding=0&small_font=1&l=

Another big boy with a lovely disposition is the Peck's Dervatiw Gwyddion...he is a good 16 hands, sire line Skowronek and dam line to *Nufoud, imported to the US by Albert Harris and she is said to be a Kuhailan Ajuz. Whatever the case if you are looking for height, athletic ability and a wonderful disposition...you should look at him as well as those above.
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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2009 :  08:58:46 AM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote


Ah thank you! you have Rameed off to a tee - he is the sweetest boy - but with a great sense of humour - who would be very naughty - if only he could bring himself to be He also has the most amazing slow motion off the floor trot




Hi Judith,

No surprise...He is definitely an athlete! But as much fun as he would love to have with you, he would never be really naughty...just a gleam in his eye for some fun! A true English gentleman!
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rosie
Platinum Member


England
3662 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2009 :  10:25:22 AM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rosie to your friends list Send rosie a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Egbert,
thank you so much for looking at Rose Alba's pedigree for me - what a fountain of information you are.
That 'extra super kindness factor' & 'pretty and motion' is spot-on Rosie.
Very interesting ideas using the Carmargue lines? - never thought of that line for her?
Thank you so much again.
Lisa




Last picture courtesy of Sweet Photography
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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2009 :  12:34:01 PM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Lisa,

Just love what *Carmargue does as a Seglawi on Kuhailan Rodania lines...But you have such a quality mare...The thing to remember is only breed to that stallion that makes your heart sing loudest! Oh and one I missed that could be absolute dynamite for you is LVA Maximus...He double Carmargue and goes to the great Davenport mare, *Hadba, a Hadban Enzahi...
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LYNDILOU
Platinum Member


United Kingdom
13976 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2009 :  12:39:29 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add LYNDILOU to your friends list Send LYNDILOU a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Gari, I thought you might like to see these pictures ? sent to me by the once owner of Bint Shantu Halima, they are of Charismma as a baby with his dam



www.dreamfield-arabians.com
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LYNDILOU
Platinum Member


United Kingdom
13976 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2009 :  12:41:17 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add LYNDILOU to your friends list Send LYNDILOU a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Also this lovely picture of Bint Shantu Halima


www.dreamfield-arabians.com
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Judith S
Platinum Member


Wales
15686 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2009 :  6:50:11 PM  Show Profile  Visit Judith S's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Judith S to your friends list Send Judith S a Private Message  Reply with Quote


Hi Judith,

No surprise...He is definitely an athlete! But as much fun as he would love to have with you, he would never be really naughty...just a gleam in his eye for some fun! A true English gentleman!
[/right]

LOL - yes - he certainly has that gleam & I agree (as does everyone that meets him) with the English gentleman bit

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rosie
Platinum Member


England
3662 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2009 :  7:29:40 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rosie to your friends list Send rosie a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Egbert,
Agree with what you say 'only breed to a stallion that makes your heart sing loudest'! - so true.
I've been looking at other lines but somehow they just didn't seem the 'right one' for Rose Alba.
Now you have planted the idea , the more I think about it, am sure a Camargue line would make my next dream horse?
Lisa




Last picture courtesy of Sweet Photography
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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 24 Mar 2009 :  11:21:16 AM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
At some point in time I am going to have a *Rushan/*Carmargue stallion that will be out of this world...but until that time comes...Yup! Think a *Carmargue, sire line Naziri will be a wunderkind for you...But go meet some of the Carmargues...Look a the dams, like that of Charismma's, Bint Shantu Halima-a fabulous mare of extraordinary quality. Looking at your mare's dam line, I do feel strongly that you would do well with either a Seglawi or Menaghy dam line to capture the quality and enhance what you already have.

Now just as an aside and a real need to BRAG...*Rushan's son Diamond Ruler L, aka Rebel, out of an old Draper line mare (old respected breeder on the West Coast of the US) was on a 30 mile endurance ride when one of the riders became ill and had to be helicoptered out. Reb had never seen a helicopter before but only leaped over a piece of sage brush and otherwise maintained his composure! This is a 4 year old out on his first major ride! His owner is thrilled beyond words that he did so well! Me, too!
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spirit
Gold Member

England
567 Posts

Posted - 29 Mar 2009 :  10:44:09 AM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add spirit to your friends list Send spirit a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Gari, I asked for your opinion last year on one of mares breeding, She is by Arastin (Simeon Sadik/Arina) out of Monosterra (Monitor/Zaneta)and she is due in may to Om EL Bahreyn (CG Balih El Jamaal/Om EL Benedict), I've got a month to wait and I'm hoping it will be as lovely as you expected! I promise some pictures of mare and foal when it arrives as you asked last year.

On another note, one of my other mares is going to be inseminated next month and I would like to know what you think of the potential cross. As does the stallion owner, Kate, who is also very excited about it. It would also be wonderful to hear a little about her breeding as well if possible.

My mare is DF Ballerina - http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/df+ballerina

The stallion is H Tobago - http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/h+tobago

Thank you Gari, much appreciated. x



Cleworth Hall Farm
df.ballerina@googlemail.com

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Timbercroft
Gold Member


Wales
936 Posts

Posted - 29 Mar 2009 :  5:42:50 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Timbercroft to your friends list Send Timbercroft a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Egbert!

Out to pick your brain again! I was wondering if you can give me your thoughts on a mare I'm thinking of putting in foal over the next two years...she is Indira

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/index.php?query_type=horse&horse=INDIRA38&g=5&cellpadding=0&small_font=1&l=

My question is... we have three boys at home ...and i was wondering which one you feel would be the best cross with her, i do have a good idea but its nice to know what you would think!
If i was wanting to improve on this filly it would be her legs(not that they are bad) just that its one thing i would like to improve, I'm always very critical of my own horses! Also i don't have to use any of my boys i could send her to another stallion ...so any ideas of good crosses would be greatly appreciated!

The boys! Sorry i did try to link it to there pages on all pedigrees but it just wont for some reason!

Madryn Tsuleem
Qamar El Dine
shamarillo el shaklan


Thanks in advance!

Linda



www.lma-arabians.co.uk
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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 30 Mar 2009 :  06:30:34 AM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi
Spirit! Well, the sire line will be Nazeer the dam line Rodania and a lot of Kuhailan in between...So this cross will be a powerhouse....Very showy is the first thing that emerges, stout yet refined, brilliant moving, first and foremost a show horse. Also if memory serves me well the mare Mifaria was supposed to be very beautiful in the flesh (the photo in All Breeds not doing her justice). All in all, think you will have a powerhouse cross.

Ballerina's sire Bambooki was a highly thought of predominately Spanish stallion, a Seglawi whose tail female traces back to the famous war mare, *Urfah over whom a battle was fought by the Bedu vs. Turkish soldiers as Homer Davenport was having her loaded into the ship! This was a mare who was coveted by all in the desert and her quality has been passed on for generations...as she is one of the winningest dam lines in the US...TC Anastasia was bred by Tom Chauncey, Polish/All American cross...Bambooki's sire is the great Sasaki, one of the most beautiful Spanish stallions to ever grace the USA. Sasaki is credited by the cognoscenti as being the main reason Magnum Psyche is so successful...as he is the sire of Magnum Psyche's dam, A Fancy Miracle...

Ballerina's dam, Minuette was a very successful show mare by the gorgeous, royally bred Silver Scenario and out of the Silver Sheen granddaughter, Mishna...All in all, Ballerina has to be great mare and wonderful broodmare.

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Egbert
Gold Member


USA
1051 Posts

Posted - 30 Mar 2009 :  07:07:15 AM  Show Profile  Visit Egbert's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add Egbert to your friends list Send Egbert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Timbercroft

Hi Egbert!

Out to pick your brain again! I was wondering if you can give me your thoughts on a mare I'm thinking of putting in foal over the next two years...she is Indira

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/index.php?query_type=horse&horse=INDIRA38&g=5&cellpadding=0&small_font=1&l=

My question is... we have three boys at home ...and i was wondering which one you feel would be the best cross with her, i do have a good idea but its nice to know what you would think!
If i was wanting to improve on this filly it would be her legs(not that they are bad) just that its one thing i would like to improve, I'm always very critical of my own horses! Also i don't have to use any of my boys i could send her to another stallion ...so any ideas of good crosses would be greatly appreciated!

The boys! Sorry i did try to link it to there pages on all pedigrees but it just wont for some reason!

Madryn Tsuleem
Qamar El Dine
shamarillo el shaklan


Thanks in advance!

Linda




Hi Linda!

Wow...Think with that pedigree you could breed her to anything and have a spectacular result but my gut says that you need to go to Shamarillo El Shaklan. He is the one Seglawi of the three and there is the old rule of Seglawi on Kuhailan for spectacular results. Indira is a Kuhailan Dajania...

Would love to see a picture of her if at all possible. She must be so lovely. Also your boys are wonderfully bred! Would like to see pictures of them as well!
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LYNDILOU
Platinum Member


United Kingdom
13976 Posts

Posted - 30 Mar 2009 :  09:34:57 AM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add LYNDILOU to your friends list Send LYNDILOU a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Nice to read your words on Ballerina, Gari, as I bred her
she was top quality since the day she was born, she stayed with me until she was 5 years old, and although she was bred for ridden, she did give me a beautiful filly from WSA Charismma.
Good luck to her now owner and hope she has the foal she dreams of


www.dreamfield-arabians.com
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spirit
Gold Member

England
567 Posts

Posted - 30 Mar 2009 :  4:35:12 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add spirit to your friends list Send spirit a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Gari, thanks for you reply, its very interesting. How amazing that she is related to war horses.

It was very hard to choose a stallion for my mare as there a so many wonderful stallions out there with so much quality. But I just love this boy and Tobago is really stamping his foals. I would love a filly as I would be keeping it to show in halter classes, then ridden, then join the breeding program. What do you think Tobago will add to her, obviously the idea is to improve on your mare when you are breeding.
This mare is so close to my heart that I couldn't wait any longer to breed from her as I needed to know I would be left with her legacy one day.
It will be so much fun choosing stallions for her in the future.
I do hope you are right about the powerhouse bit. I know Lynda (her breeder) always said she was given her name 'Ballerina' as she floated round the field like a dancer. Minette's foals have been known to all be very proud of themselves and true matriarch mares, this is definitely the case where Ballerina is concerned, she loves an audience and always looks like she should be parading a foal at her side.
Can you recommend any other stallions that would be suitable choices for the future, I had thought of AV Montoya as it would be a double Sasaki foal, and also I love LVA Maximus's Spanish lines.
All these lucky people with wonderful stallions.
Thank you Gari. Here are hopefully some pictures of bally. Im pretty useless as this picture business. click on the link to pictures if they dont work.

[img/]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2313/1551139228_7cd860e5b2_o.jpg[img]
[img/]http://farm1.static.flickr.com/148/354000329_217023afec_o.jpg[img]


Cleworth Hall Farm
df.ballerina@googlemail.com

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